Anyone here acquire some of these? What are your thoughts? I don't like pdfs much is part of my hesitation, but I'm sure these are pretty neat and it is good they are available. http://www.conchord.org/xeno/aande.html
There was a discussion at one point on G+ about a whole bunch of people going in together to buy the complete catalogue of PDFs of A&E, but it never came to pass. I was willing to chip in!
I've never seen an issue, but I'm fascinated by the idea of a continuously running, massive zine like this that goes all the way back to the early days of the hobby.
A&E is a small operation. They sell PDF's to help cover their costs and let someone get access to issues that are very difficult and expensive to get in printed form. Those PDFs are meant to be bought and used by one person. Having 150 people club together and pay $1 each so they can all get access to 150 issues all they want isn't the way PDF sales work.
I highly recommend the first 30 issues. I have thes in original hardcopies and they are difficult to use. PDFs would be a dream. These are historical documents about the beginning of RPGs. Im not sure how much gaming material or ideas can be gleaned from them but you get an amazing chain of conversations including Gygax and the original problems that shut down TSRs openess to fan created material.
Got the first 6 issues in PDF format from Lee Gold. They are fascinating and give a glimpse into how people played the game early on. It is also interesting to read these in light of some of Tim Kask’s recent interviews or Vlog on youtube—you can read about some of the house rules that TSR reacted to through the supplements and magazines.
One warning. A&E was an offshoot of APA-L and in some ways it feels like listen in on the middle of a conversation.
I have the first 20 or 30 issues (can’t recall). These include some great insights into how players back then (1975-) really responded to D&D. Parts of it feel to me like a "lo-fi" version of the odd74 discussion board, and there's a bunch of unconstrained creativity in there. It's an important record, and it's fascinating to see that some of the same questions and debates asked back then are still going on today :)
Wolfgang Coe I have a list of Hargrave issues and will post it later this morning. If you can't wait, navigate to RPGGeek, search for A&E, and look at the ToCs. Somebody is indexing the entire run, but I don't think Patrick has gotten back to the Hargrave issues.
Wolfgang Coe , I found my electronic list: 23, 25, 26, 27, 28, 30, 32, 33, 34, 38, 42, 43, 44, 45, 46, 47, 48, 49, 50, 51, 53, 55, 57, 58, 59, 61, 62, 63, 64, 65, 66, 67, 68, 69, 70, 71 (maybe), 84, 97, 148. Those are the DAH issues. Note that Paul Mosher also contributed Arduin material to A&E and their respective zines generated discussion from others.
Scott Mob I've at least skimmed most of the issues from #23 through 50. Adventures seem scarce. Loads of play reports & discussion of now-obscure & rare games. These early issues were a crucible for D&D, Chivalry & Sorcery, & Runequest variants. I personally get lots of design insight from John T. Sapienza Jr., David Hargrave, Paul Mosher, Peggy Gemignani, Steve Marsh, & Ed Simbalist.
Scott Mob I can't recall any actual playable dungeon levels or scenarios/modules in the earlier A&Es. Now, I've only seen #1-30 and some of the issues in the 40s that I used to own in hardcopy. My guess is that it was assumed back then that everyone would make their own levels.
I have printed originals or PDFs of the first 150 or so issues. They are a wonderful hodge podge of stories, rules, and comments on a number of games systems, although at least 80% of it is D&D. I can't recall seeing much scenario material in there, especially with maps, stats, and lots of detail. There's a lot of home-brewed rules, and ongoing commentary between the writers about what they thought of each other's articles from prior issues.
If you are unfamiliar with what a typical issue of A&E was like, it basically had about 20 contributors per monthly issue. There was about a three month delay in what was submitted before it appeared in a print. Each contributor typed up around 4-8 pages of material. Some people would write about a single topic, like Archery rules for D&D. Some people would submit fantasy fiction. Others would write mainly about what other people had submitted in a prior issue, kind of like mini reviews of other people's submissions.
There was a discussion at one point on G+ about a whole bunch of people going in together to buy the complete catalogue of PDFs of A&E, but it never came to pass. I was willing to chip in!
ReplyDeleteI've never seen an issue, but I'm fascinated by the idea of a continuously running, massive zine like this that goes all the way back to the early days of the hobby.
You can always have them printed on the cheap through Lulu
ReplyDeleteI have a few. Older ones. Great for OD&D
ReplyDeleteI just want the Hargave ones
ReplyDeleteDoes anyone have list of which A&E Hargrave contributed to? Those interest me as well.
ReplyDeleteThis is a discussion that includes some info on indexing efforts etc odd74.proboards.com - Alarums and Excursions - pdf back issues | Original D&D Discussion
ReplyDeleteI have the first 30. Quality is mixed but readable. Lee specifically asks purchasers not to distribute them to others.
ReplyDeleteA&E is a small operation. They sell PDF's to help cover their costs and let someone get access to issues that are very difficult and expensive to get in printed form. Those PDFs are meant to be bought and used by one person. Having 150 people club together and pay $1 each so they can all get access to 150 issues all they want isn't the way PDF sales work.
ReplyDeleteI agree with everyone, I promise not to participate in doing that.
ReplyDeleteI highly recommend the first 30 issues. I have thes in original hardcopies and they are difficult to use. PDFs would be a dream. These are historical documents about the beginning of RPGs. Im not sure how much gaming material or ideas can be gleaned from them but you get an amazing chain of conversations including Gygax and the original problems that shut down TSRs openess to fan created material.
ReplyDeleteGot the first 6 issues in PDF format from Lee Gold. They are fascinating and give a glimpse into how people played the game early on. It is also interesting to read these in light of some of Tim Kask’s recent interviews or Vlog on youtube—you can read about some of the house rules that TSR reacted to through the supplements and magazines.
ReplyDeleteOne warning. A&E was an offshoot of APA-L and in some ways it feels like listen in on the middle of a conversation.
If you look up A&E or the APA-L on rpggeek.com you can sometimes finds a table of contents and usually one other page (see: https://rpggeek.com/rpgperiodical/35764/apa-l and https://rpggeek.com/rpgperiodical/1494/alarums-excursions). That will give you an idea of what the publications are like.
Zach H do the first 30 cover all the Holmes D&D "era" issues?
ReplyDeleteI have the first 20 or 30 issues (can’t recall). These include some great insights into how players back then (1975-) really responded to D&D. Parts of it feel to me like a "lo-fi" version of the odd74 discussion board, and there's a bunch of unconstrained creativity in there. It's an important record, and it's fascinating to see that some of the same questions and debates asked back then are still going on today :)
ReplyDeleteWolfgang Coe I have a list of Hargrave issues and will post it later this morning. If you can't wait, navigate to RPGGeek, search for A&E, and look at the ToCs. Somebody is indexing the entire run, but I don't think Patrick has gotten back to the Hargrave issues.
ReplyDeleteWolfgang Coe , I found my electronic list: 23, 25, 26, 27, 28, 30, 32, 33, 34, 38, 42, 43, 44, 45, 46, 47, 48, 49, 50, 51, 53, 55, 57, 58, 59, 61, 62, 63, 64, 65, 66, 67, 68, 69, 70, 71 (maybe), 84, 97, 148. Those are the DAH issues. Note that Paul Mosher also contributed Arduin material to A&E and their respective zines generated discussion from others.
ReplyDeletesub
ReplyDeleteGabriel Roark TYVM.
ReplyDeleteJust bought #1 to #30. Man, Lee is fast on the email. I don't think she sleeps. :-)
ReplyDeleteMichael Thomas , lol, she is just on West Coast time! But yeah, she doesn't mess about! :)
ReplyDeleteMichael Thomas If by Holmes-era, you mean his contributions, yes. If you mean the era of Holmes Basic, it only covers the beginning. #30 is Jan '78.
ReplyDeleteYes, I suspect I may be investing in more issues soon!
ReplyDeleteHow much in the way of actual adventures are in these early issues? Any standouts? Or standout articles? Thanks.
ReplyDelete.
ReplyDeleteScott Mob I've at least skimmed most of the issues from #23 through 50. Adventures seem scarce. Loads of play reports & discussion of now-obscure & rare games. These early issues were a crucible for D&D, Chivalry & Sorcery, & Runequest variants. I personally get lots of design insight from John T. Sapienza Jr., David Hargrave, Paul Mosher, Peggy Gemignani, Steve Marsh, & Ed Simbalist.
ReplyDeleteScott Mob I can't recall any actual playable dungeon levels or scenarios/modules in the earlier A&Es. Now, I've only seen #1-30 and some of the issues in the 40s that I used to own in hardcopy. My guess is that it was assumed back then that everyone would make their own levels.
ReplyDeleteI have printed originals or PDFs of the first 150 or so issues. They are a wonderful hodge podge of stories, rules, and comments on a number of games systems, although at least 80% of it is D&D. I can't recall seeing much scenario material in there, especially with maps, stats, and lots of detail. There's a lot of home-brewed rules, and ongoing commentary between the writers about what they thought of each other's articles from prior issues.
ReplyDeleteIf you are unfamiliar with what a typical issue of A&E was like, it basically had about 20 contributors per monthly issue. There was about a three month delay in what was submitted before it appeared in a print. Each contributor typed up around 4-8 pages of material. Some people would write about a single topic, like Archery rules for D&D. Some people would submit fantasy fiction. Others would write mainly about what other people had submitted in a prior issue, kind of like mini reviews of other people's submissions.
ReplyDeleteIm mainly picked them up for the RuneQuest related articles.
ReplyDelete